DODGERS Around the MLB Thread

Discussion in 'Los Angeles DODGERS' started by MZA, Nov 16, 2011.

  1. IBleedBlue15

    IBleedBlue15 DSP Stud

    Joined:
    Nov 2011
    Messages:
    16,150
    Likes Received:
    5,815
    Trophy Points:
    198

    Billingsley.
     
  2. doyerfan

    doyerfan MODERATOR Staff Member Moderator

    Joined:
    Nov 2011
    Messages:
    26,713
    Likes Received:
    13,016
    Trophy Points:
    228
    I wish their was some medicine that was allowed that could fix it quicker than currently. Some will call it a steroid, but pitchers get injured for no fucking reason and I'd love for that to cut down with some injection of some sort.
     
  3. chris

    chris Guest

    Tommy John surgery most likely. Depends on how torn the ligament is. Think Strasburg, Bills, Wainwright
     
  4. BigDaddyKaine

    BigDaddyKaine DSP Legend

    Joined:
    Nov 2011
    Messages:
    11,884
    Likes Received:
    6,117
    Trophy Points:
    198
    Damn, sucks for Harvey and the Mets.
     
  5. Dodgers99

    Dodgers99 DSP Legend

    Joined:
    Nov 2011
    Messages:
    4,131
    Likes Received:
    2,253
    Trophy Points:
    153
    Hopefully he doesn't make the same dumbass mistake that Bills and he can get back for opening day 2015, if not september 2014.
     
  6. Jpdodgers

    Jpdodgers Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2013
    Messages:
    369
    Likes Received:
    201
    Trophy Points:
    53
    Sucks for Harvey. Hate to see this keep happening to these young pitchers. It seems like every fireballing (97+ mph) young arm blows it out for some reason.

    This is just overall bad for baseball.
     
  7. phils phanatic

    phils phanatic Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2013
    Messages:
    423
    Likes Received:
    56
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Wow and mets said a week or two ago they only planned on 4 or 5 more starts for him this season and now he's looking dead in the face of TJ surgery and likely missing all next year
     
  8. LAFord

    LAFord DSP Legend

    Joined:
    Nov 2011
    Messages:
    8,465
    Likes Received:
    4,267
    Trophy Points:
    173
    This is why I'm scared to sign pitchers(like the CK deal or Greinke's). Noone saw this coming.
     
  9. Dodgers99

    Dodgers99 DSP Legend

    Joined:
    Nov 2011
    Messages:
    4,131
    Likes Received:
    2,253
    Trophy Points:
    153
    Seeing the way that Wainwright, Zimmerman and Strasburg (among others) have come back recently makes it worth the risk.
     
  10. VRP

    VRP DSP Legend

    Joined:
    Nov 2011
    Messages:
    14,823
    Likes Received:
    9,002
    Trophy Points:
    198
    Ummmmm. In his career it's been his best pitch by far.

    http://www.mikesciosciastragicillness.com/2013/08/17/zack-greinke-getting-by-without-his-best-pitch/
     
    Irish and chris like this.
  11. BleedBlue

    BleedBlue DSP Regular

    Joined:
    Jun 2013
    Messages:
    1,841
    Likes Received:
    764
    Trophy Points:
    123
    Yeah, his slider was damn near unhittable in his Cy Young season.
     
  12. phils phanatic

    phils phanatic Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2013
    Messages:
    423
    Likes Received:
    56
    Trophy Points:
    28
    That's actually a common misconception with greinke.his curve and slider are almost identical(same general speed and trajectory) but the curve is a bigger break whereas the slider is late break.when greinke was ON(I.e his cy young campaign) he would throw both in any count against any hitter.actually at one point it "common knowledge" among scouts that greinke and zito had the best curves in the league
     
  13. phils phanatic

    phils phanatic Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2013
    Messages:
    423
    Likes Received:
    56
    Trophy Points:
    28
    While the success rate of pitchers coming back from TJ is very good, it's not at all good for any kind of shoulder surgery
     
  14. VRP

    VRP DSP Legend

    Joined:
    Nov 2011
    Messages:
    14,823
    Likes Received:
    9,002
    Trophy Points:
    198
    I don't get what you're saying. Maybe his curveball was thought by scouts to be his best breaking ball, but it clearly wasn't close according to the numbers. Saying it was never a plus-plus pitch is foolish, the numbers and any pitching coach in the league would laugh that off.
     
  15. chris

    chris Guest

    No, it's not a missconception.

    http://brooksbaseball.net/outcome.p...rtDate=03/30/2007&endDate=08/27/2013&s_type=2
    You can see his slider he threw very much. As recently as the beginning of the year he was throwing it but now he completely scrapped it from his arsenal. Cutter usage starts last year and spikes this year.

    Also, his slider and curve ball are thrown not even close to the same speed. His slider was anywhere from 85-88 and curve was 69-75. The movement is also noticeably different. Which is the definition of the curveball (softer and more vertical movement) and slider (more speed and horizontal movement).
    You can see that here:
    http://brooksbaseball.net/velo.php?...ype=2&startDate=03/30/2007&endDate=08/27/2013
     
    blazer5 and VRP like this.
  16. VRP

    VRP DSP Legend

    Joined:
    Nov 2011
    Messages:
    14,823
    Likes Received:
    9,002
    Trophy Points:
    198
    Owned #rig
     
    blazer5 and chris like this.
  17. phils phanatic

    phils phanatic Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2013
    Messages:
    423
    Likes Received:
    56
    Trophy Points:
    28
    For starters I agreed with the fact he scrapped his slider.also,I'm not talking solely this year and if u look at your charts you'll see that his slide and curve were thrown pretty equally throughout the years.also,using your charts if you go back to 2007(his peak) you'll see his velocity on the curve and slider are very similar,curve around 82-84 and slider solidly around 85.his curve has always been the better pitch and scouts attest to that.
     
  18. phils phanatic

    phils phanatic Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2013
    Messages:
    423
    Likes Received:
    56
    Trophy Points:
    28
    There's a difference between a plus-plus pitch and a quality pitch.for instance the only pitch zach wheeler has that scouts consider plus is his fastball but that doesn't mean he shouldn't throw anything else,it doesn't mean that he can't throw anything else,and it doesn't mean he can't get outs with other pitches.also it's often pitchers survive on having multiple quality pitches and none that rate out as plus-plus pitches,it then just becomes basically a mental game of chess and keeping hitters off balance
     
  19. irish

    irish DSP Staff Member Administrator

    Joined:
    Nov 2011
    Messages:
    51,147
    Likes Received:
    37,575
    Trophy Points:
    278
  20. SC_Ed

    SC_Ed DSP Legend Damned

    Joined:
    Nov 2011
    Messages:
    1,422
    Likes Received:
    511
    Trophy Points:
    153
    All this scout lingo is quite boring.

    Unless you're a professional scout do you really know what a "Plus Pitch" is? Do professional scouts even know what that is? I think you'd find disagreement even from pros what defines a plus slider or plus power etc... vs quality slider and quality power.

    Some guys talent is quite obvious but arguing over plus/quality pitches is silly.

    MLB execs make much more subjective decisions than you guys give them credit for.
     
    CapnTreee and blazer5 like this.

Share This Page