OFFSEASON NEWS/RUMORS Thread

Discussion in 'Los Angeles DODGERS' started by irish, Oct 12, 2019.

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in 2020, mookie betts starts the season with...

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  1. No Name

    No Name Well-Known Member

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    I think too many are confusing or purposely confusing Stan's words. He isnt trying to pull the wool over the fans eyes. He is trying to sign guys but only to the realm of what they consider rational and reasonable.

    That changes the debate as to whether we agree with their rules, not if the front office is bullshitting the fans.
     
  2. irish

    irish DSP Staff Member Administrator

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    respectfully disagree
    kasten presumes to know what fans want
    last winter he even told a reporter...
    “I’ll tell you what fans like better than free agent stars and I absolutely will show you proof of this. They like homegrown kids that develop into stars. They like that better.”
    that's an exact quote, and he has yet to follow up on the proof he claimed to show us
    a lot like when jamie mccourt said fans would rather spend money on building inner city fields than sign Manny Ramirez.
    and there's also this...


    Stan Kasten has a funny way of putting things
    by Houston Mitchell | Assistant Sports Editor L.A. Times — 29 January 2019

    Stan Kasten says some strange things.

    The Dodgers had their annual FanFest over the weekend. FanFest is a really great event that gets fans pumped up for the new season and allows them to get close to and even meet their favorite players. In general, it’s an excellent source of goodwill between the team and the fans.

    Some of those fans are the same ones who have been complaining to me and to other fans that they are frustrated the Dodgers have not gone over the luxury tax threshold to sign a player such as Bryce Harper. In their view, the hit the Dodgers will take in surpassing the threshold (According to MLB.com, a club exceeding the Competitive Balance Tax threshold for the first time must pay a 20% tax on all overages) is worth the cost of adding a superstar to the team, especially following the loss of Manny Machado, Matt Kemp, Yasiel Puig, Alex Wood and Yasmani Grandal from last season.

    Some fans are fine with how things are, but there is a segment of the fan base that has that frustration. The frustration is that they believe team officials are not going all out to win and are more worried about payroll.

    Team President Stan Kasten was at FanFest, and he apparently thinks those fans don’t exist.

    When Times columnist Dylan Hernandez brought up that some fans believe the team needs to do more than has been done this offseason, Kasten said, “You keep making this stuff up.”

    I’m going to quote directly from Dylan’s column now:

    Eighty-nine cents of every dollar goes directly to children. Here's how it's done.

    The Dodgers kept their payroll under the luxury-tax threshold of $197 million last year, which would prevent them from being taxed at a higher rate for repeat offenders if they spent more than the limit of $206 million this year. So, if they would be penalized as a first-time offender this year and have plenty of money coming off the books next year, why haven’t they spent more this offseason? Is this a warning of what is to come in future seasons?

    “That’s also such a weird narrative,” Kasten said. “If we can do whatever we do and stay under [the luxury-tax threshold], there are a lot of advantages to being under — by the way, a lot more advantages than you all write about.”

    Such as?

    “I’m not going to go into that because that’s real inside baseball economic stuff,” Kasten said.

    OK, that ends the except from Dylan.

    That is a weird narrative Kasten wants out there. When I read it, reacting as a Dodger fan, my first thought was “Kasten thinks Dodger fans are too dumb to understand what benefits the team gets.” Plus, he totally dismissed the fans out there that don’t understand why they don’t spend more by saying that it’s something the media have made up. I guess the people who email me are figments of my imagination.

    There’s no getting around the fact that Kasten totally blew off a segment of the team’s fan base. When told that, he reacted by saying:

    “You’re inventing a narrative that I don’t agree with because, like I said, I can almost tell you for sure, we’re going to lead the National League in attendance again. You’re inventing a different universe that is not borne out by reality, by facts.”

    So, as long as you are spending the money, you can’t possibly be frustrated or question anything, and you don’t need to know anything.

    Here was a chance for the president of the team to really respond and let fans know what the Dodgers are thinking. A chance to say, “We know some fans are frustrated, but here’s why we want to stay under the tax.”

    Maybe he was just frustrated with Dylan and got angry and he stopped thinking clearly. But it’s part of the team president’s job to think clearly and not let his emotions get the best of him. He could have said, “I don’t like this line of questioning. I don’t have time at FanFest to go into all the details of why this is beneficial for us. Call me tomorrow and we can go over all the reasons, so the fans know what is going on.”

    Or, “I understand some fans are unhappy, but there are certain financial reasons I can’t go into at the moment.”

    Or, “I understand some fans are unhappy, but we made the World Series the last two seasons, so we ask those fans to trust that we know what we are doing.”

    Instead we get: “Those fans don’t exist. We can tell because we have such high attendance.” Kasten handled it in the worst manner possible.

    I’m not sure what one has to do with the other. Because I can be frustrated with the team and still want to go to the games and support the team. I get mad at my daughters sometimes, but that doesn’t mean I don’t love and support them. And many people consider the Dodgers part of the family.

    Unfortunately, a prominent Dodger doesn’t consider some of you to be part of their family.

    So, here’s the thing, the Dodgers have a public number on their website to reach their administrative offices. It is 866-DODGERS, Ext. 9. If you would like to be told how staying under the balance tax helps the team, go ahead and call. There’s none of you out there, so I’m sure no one will call, right?
     
  3. No Name

    No Name Well-Known Member

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    Are you saying that fans prefer free agent starts to home grown stars?
     
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  4. irish

    irish DSP Staff Member Administrator

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    not at all
    but a lot might prefer established stars to unproven prospects
     
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  5. No Name

    No Name Well-Known Member

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    I agree. Which is why I agree with the idea that if the Dodgers are going to make a move it should be a clear improvement. However, I do not believe in abandoning the plan to appease fans. That's what I believe Kasten is saying, albeit in a way devoid of tact and understanding of the fans.

    I think that young players are more valuable commodity than cash because they print cash and save cash. They draw hype when they are drafted, when they create a prospect buzz and when they get called up.

    However, me personally I am getting to the point where I just want to get a buzz again. To know that there is a change in variable. I truly do believe in their model but my fandom is starting to ooze through their cracks.
     
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  6. Fall Winslow

    Fall Winslow Back 2 Sleepy

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    Crooks. Dodgers are past the point of angling for " reasonable signings ". They're in the phase of the rebuild of the org where they should go above and beyond - which they tried to do with Cole - which is what it takes to win the services of elite talent whether we're talking elite free agents or elite trade targets with team control.

    There's no excuse for what they're doing at this point. No excuse for offering major free agents mega contracts with deferred money. None of the superstars that are under the Boras umbrella have accepted deferred money. May as well call these offers disingenuous
     
  7. Fall Winslow

    Fall Winslow Back 2 Sleepy

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    What you have to love most about Kasten's words there is the impact they should and likely will have on superstar free agents and the way they look at the Dodgers under Guggenheim management moving forward.

    If you're a major free agent, why even look the Dodgers' way in free agency? There it is right there..in words from the president..the fans aren't going to appreciate you as much as they appreciate Belli or Kershaw. Lol You just don't see execs go out of their way to alienate potential big impact additions the way Kasten did there. And all in the name of feeding his own fan base a plate of BS
     
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  8. ColoradoKidWitGame

    ColoradoKidWitGame DSP Legend Administrator

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    The second and third highest paid Dodgers from 2019 have signed with the Twins. Homer Bailey and Rich Hill going to the Twin Cities.

    The Dodgers and Hill were said to be interested in a reunion, so curious on what happened here since Hill seemed like a valuable gamble. Anyway, so long Dick Mountain.

    Update: sounds like it is an MLB deal for Hill with at least a $3M guarantee which makes more sense for why the Dodgers moved on. Sounds like most teams were only interested in MiLB deals due to his surgery.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2019
  9. No Name

    No Name Well-Known Member

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    You are taking a big leap to say that those comments are alienating free agents. Kasten has a long career of success.

    Did the Dodgers defer payments I. Their offer to Cole?
     
  10. ColoradoKidWitGame

    ColoradoKidWitGame DSP Legend Administrator

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    No real news out there that involve the Dodgers. Only thing kinda being kicked around is that the Red Sox are supposedly telling free agents that they have zero free payroll to work with at the moment. A couple agents have reached out to the club about MiLB or minimum deals for players trying to rebuild their stock and were told that they had nothing for them. This has included at least Travis Shaw and Steve Cishek according to reports. If this is the case, the Sox will almost have to make some major moves in the weeks ahead. There has been more speculation recently that the Dodgers COULD actually have interest in David Price, but the belief is they only would be if he was accompanied by Mookie Betts. The Blue Jays were said to be interested in Price before signing Ryu.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2019
  11. ColoradoKidWitGame

    ColoradoKidWitGame DSP Legend Administrator

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    Yes, the Dodgers offer had deferrals, though no idea what they were. The Yankees 2nd to last offer also was said to have deferrals as well, but in their final offer they removed them and added another year. Cole is rumored to have told Boras not to counter the Dodgers offer as it has been reported that he wanted to play for the Yankees.
     
  12. Fall Winslow

    Fall Winslow Back 2 Sleepy

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    Where you are now, defending Kasten/Guggs, is where I was when they were paying through the nose in luxury tax.

    Take it from someone who was on the other side..the battle is not worth your time. They're full of shit. End of story.


    https://dodgerblue.com/dodgers-free...ffers-eight-years-deferred-salary/2019/12/12/
     
  13. Fall Winslow

    Fall Winslow Back 2 Sleepy

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    Goes back to when I said David Price is going to be the reason that we don't get Betts. Someone else is gonna hop on that package..maybe Milwaukee. They enjoy coming out of nowhere and doing shit every so often.

    How fun would it be if Lerner/Nats said - to hell with it, lets truly keep our foot on the Dodgers' throat - and they stepped up for Price/Betts? How does Betts fit into that Nats' lineup? Michael Taylor potentially goes to Boston or elsewhere for a year, but the thump they lost from Rendon's departure, they'd get some of that back with Betts. Nats have to feel like that window is open and with one swift power move like that, they're right back where they want to be next season
     
  14. ColoradoKidWitGame

    ColoradoKidWitGame DSP Legend Administrator

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    I definitely think someone is going to jump in and snag Price at this point, but I don't think either of those teams would be them. Lerner has already said that they are about tapped out financially, so adding close to $60M in payroll for the upcoming season does not seem reasonable. Same thing goes for the Brewers who are also said to be close to tapped out. A team like the Giants is someone that I could totally see doing this. They could do something like Belt for Price and buy a couple of prospects as well, then try to build up his value in that park/this division, then send him out at the deadline or later plus buy down his contract to get better prospects as well. That seems like a Zaidi type move.
     
  15. ColoradoKidWitGame

    ColoradoKidWitGame DSP Legend Administrator

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    Huge difference here in that Sale still had 3 years of control at an extremely below market figure+AAV and was one of the best 2 or 3 pitchers in baseball. Moncada was the #2 prospect in baseball at the height of the Cuban explosion and was showing some MAJOR red flags for a number of scouts that had many thinking his prospect ranking should have been dropping. It was also at the height of teams undervaluing prospects before the pendulum has now swung all the way to the other side. I don't disagree that to get star players, you need to move star prospects, but there is a time and a place. For one year of control of a guy that is making $30M and has said he is going to test the open market no matter what? No. For a guy with multiple years of control? Yes.
     
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  16. THINKBLUE

    THINKBLUE DSP Gigolo

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    I hope somebody grabs Price before we even think about it
     
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  17. LASports96

    LASports96 DSP Legend

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    Have we fucking signed anybody?
     
  18. ColoradoKidWitGame

    ColoradoKidWitGame DSP Legend Administrator

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    So who is left on the free agent market that could honestly be considered improvements to this club in the year ahead?

    3B Josh Donaldson - We have discussed at great length already why he would be an improvement for this team, so I won't go into a ton of detail. He is an upgrade offensively and defensively at 3B, would lengthen the lineup and would not cost the team anything, but money compared to everyone else that would cost prospects.

    CIF/COF Nicholas Castellanos- He is an upgrade exclusively in regards to his bat and if it means that Pollock is jettisoned into the sun, great! He was a beast on the Cubs and some folks think it was due to him finally being motivated after wallowing around the last couple years with a terrible Tigers team. Speaking of terrible, his defense is a catastrophe and hiding him is no easy task. Could the Dodgers well respected defensive analytics department do enough to make him passable in the OF to make everything work? Who knows, but he is a far from likely option for a club that values defense so highly.

    RHP Jimmy Nelson- He is one of two starting pitchers on the FA market that you can honestly look at and say, "there is HUGE upside here". Nelson is coming off of a major injury and has barely pitched since that injury occurred in 2017. When he first came back in June of this year, his velo was down a few ticks. He then went back on the DL only to emerge 3 months later in a relief role flashing similar readings to his pre-injury days. When he went down in 2017, he was emerging as a legit front of the rotation pitcher. The worry here is that the starting pitching starved Brewers could have retained him for under $4M this year and ended up walking away entirely, so there could be some bad medicals in there. He still has interesting upside for the back of the rotation or if that does not work, as a reliever with 4 decent pitches to call on.

    RHP Taijuan Walker- Still only 27 years old, Walker is not long removed from being one of the top pitching prospects in baseball. After a solid, but not stunning couple of years, Walker finally broke out in 2017. The K numbers have never translated to the pros like once expected, but Walker could still be a decent buy low candidate at this point. The biggest issues here are that he has steadily lost velo since first coming up where he would sit 95-96(with higher readings in MiLB) before barely sitting 94 in 2017. In his one inning out of the pen this year, he sat around 93. 2020 will be his second year from TJ and that is usually where players get more comfortable and look more like the pitcher they are going to be. He is in the same regard as Jimmy Nelson where he could get an audition as a starter and if things aren't great they can always see what he could do in the bullpen.

    RHP Will Harris- He is getting a lot of shit for "imploding" in games 6 and 7 of the WS after a dominating regular season and playoffs up to that point. First things first, the HR to Rendon in Game 6 is a flyout in all but maybe two parks in MLB and he happened to be playing in one of them. Was it a bad pitch? You betcha. Was it some bad luck also? You could say that. Then there is the game 7 HR to Kendrick on the bottom outside corner of the plate that hit the bottom of the foul pole in RF. Was that a bad pitch? Not at all. Was that bad luck? You betcha. Harris still has one of the best fastball/curve combos in baseball and while his velo dropped a bit in 2019, he still enjoyed his best season to date. He gets himself out of jams better than most and is likely not the elite back end reliever his ERA and WHIP would tell you he is, but he would make for a more than suitable reliable middle reliever that, yes you could likely trust in the playoffs.

    RHP Daniel Hudson- The one who got away? Not sure you could really say that as Hudson ended his Dodgers tenure on a very sour note... and almost ended his Nats one in a similar way in game 5 of the NLDS. Hudson was very good for the entirety of the regular season before escaping a couple of self made jams against the Dodgers and then getting beat up by the Astros. Hudson is a wild card as he is not a surefire, but he did see some positives this past year. One of those was that his fastball ticked almost all the way back up to where it was a few seasons ago and saw more success after dropping his slider usage and upping his FB/Cutter rate to a career high 70%. If he is the closer, then the Dodgers are likely experiencing problems, but once again if he is somewhere in the middle, he would be a solid option ahead of the back end of the pen.

    Only one of these guys is a tried and true superstar and that is Donaldson. He makes plenty of sense for this club, but it seems like they have other preferences first. As for the other names, they are decent fillers on a roster that does still have solid depth regardless of how the season ended. This is more for people that want to say "WHY DIDN'T WE SIGN THAT GUY!?" in the weeks ahead as most if not all other options on the market are simply not intriguing enough to take shots at for the club. This club is about out of "money only" options to improve this club and this has been beyond frustrating to watch.
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2019
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  19. ColoradoKidWitGame

    ColoradoKidWitGame DSP Legend Administrator

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    Only way I'd be ok with them bringing him in is if he is paired with a Boegarts or Betts acquisition and the prospect cost is minimal. That would be the only way for that to happen anyway, but like I said earlier, someone else could very easily jump in and kill our chances of "stealing" Betts.
     
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  20. ColoradoKidWitGame

    ColoradoKidWitGame DSP Legend Administrator

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    Twins have reportedly offered Josh Donaldson a deal of 4 years in the neighborhood on $90M. This seems like a pretty decent price for the star 3B who may be best suited for an AL team as he ages.
     

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